In this podcast, Scott Brown and Jason Dohn, joined by special guest Jeff Johnson, discuss Jeremiah’s charge to the captives in Babylon to build, dwell, and plant for the honor of God (Jer. 29:5-6), rather than fearfully bow to the evil culture that surrounded them. It’s this message of hope that will be the focus of Church & Family Life’s Build, Dwell, Plant Conference, to be held in Ridgecrest, North Carolina on April 24-26. Whether in prosperity or peril, the culture of family life should be built to flourish—with Christians seeking first God’s kingdom as they build. 

 

Join Us for the Build, Dwell, Plant Conference. 

Welcome to the Church and Family Life podcast. Today we've got Jeff Johnson to come and talk about the conference. He's going to give a great message there. We have a super street level, practical, encouraging conference, Build, Dwell, Plant, coming up at the end of April. Hope you can be there and hope you enjoy the discussions with Jeff Johnson and Jason Dome.

Jason, we've got a big conference coming up, Build, Dwell, Plant, How to Have Your Family in Babylon. How many years in a row at Ridgecrest now? Do you know the answer? A lot. 15, I don't know, something like that.

A lot of years. And another year with Jeff Johnson. We're glad about that. Yeah, we sure are. Good to see you again.

Jeff is going to talk about prayer in Babylon. Yeah, Daniel in prayer. Daniel in prayer in Babylon. Yeah, I'm very excited. Yeah.

Thanks so much for coming man I really appreciate coming over over the last few years people love it when you come Well, this is what my fourth maybe fourth time to be there probably Yeah, it's been great. My family loves it. At this point, we're, we're, you know, we're stuck. You know, we, my family would be in revolt if we didn't come. Good.

That's awesome. Yeah. And it's always nice to see so many of your church members. I got to meet one of your elders last year at a restaurant, actually. That was really fun.

Yeah. Our church, I think, should be heavily represented again this year. There are several families already making plans, and we're thinking about what type of caravan we're coming down with. And so it's exciting. It's exciting for a lot of us.

It's such a wonderful time, not for just pastors, but for Christians and children. My kids love it. My wife loves it. Our church family loves it. So it's just a wonderful, wonderful event.

And we're so thankful that you all put this on. It's a joy and to just see so many families coming together all the kids sitting there listening to the group to actually my favorite preachers okay that's really really a happy time for me and my family. And hey, I don't do hardly anything at this conference. I just talk to people. I give a couple of messages and then I'm totally available.

My time is really free just to talk to people. Yeah. Your staff is wonderful. They are. Yeah, I've noticed that.

I think I've asked you that a couple of times. You and Jason both are able to just visit and mingle and be there for everybody. It's just a good time because it's a good balance of wonderful preaching. You've got a lot of wonderful content being proclaimed and taught. But it's also just enough time for fellowship.

The Ridgecrest facilities are beautiful. The environment's beautiful. There's time for the kids to play. There's times for just setting on the rocking chairs and visiting. It's just a relaxing, relaxing atmosphere that blends a good conference with good fellowship.

It's just a sweet, sweet dynamic. Yeah, to your point, there's a set of friends that I have that I treasure, but I only see once a year, just because we're in different circles in different places. And then this is the one time a year I see them. So as much as I love the preaching, I do love the preaching of these conferences. I almost love the cracks of time in between and around the preaching, at least as much, because I get to see this group of friends.

Yeah. Yeah. And when we planned this conference, this was before the election, and we want to talk about families thriving in Babylon. And I mean, it's, it felt like the claws of Babylon were clenching down on the culture, you know, with the previous administration and just the flow of the culture. And then now we have a president who's rolled back a lot of the ungodly, horrific things that have been in the culture.

But here's the thing, The culture really hasn't changed. The churches really haven't changed and the people haven't really changed. Policies, some policies have changed at the top level. And I'm, I'm thrilled with, I'm thrilled with them actually. So grateful that we have a president that says there are only two genders.

That's okay. Life begins at conception. I mean, that's a blessing. That's wonderful. I know.

Take what you can get. Yeah. I mean, it's like, well, we're hearing this wonderful thing. There's only two gingers, but it's sad you have to see. Yeah, we're excited.

We should be saying, duh. The sun is in the sky. Yeah, we have to say that. Which means that Jeremiah 29 is such a helpful chapter for us. Jeremiah 29 is the letter to the people who are in captivity and are charged with continuing a culture to walk with God in the middle of a pagan land.

So nobody needs to connect those dots. It's obvious that this is a chapter we need. Yeah. And I think Babylon is a helpful paradigm. It is.

I've been asked before, why does the Lord not zap us right into heaven once we believe, once we're saved, get us right into heaven and sanctify us completely and be glorified immediately? You know, the thief on the cross got to enjoy that. And why is that not the experience the rest of us? And it's a good question. But, you know, Jesus said, you know, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves.

And as the Father sent me into this world, He sends us into the world. And so we have a real mission. We're not here and left accidentally into this world, this Babylon that we live in. We have a purpose, and it's a good purpose, and it is to mirror the purpose that Christ came and He lived in this world, and we're to live in this world. And we've been promised victory and we've been promised that the Holy Spirit will attend to us and go with us.

And we've got all these wonderful promises, but we have a mission to accomplish in this world. And it's a wonderful thing in some ways, even though it's trying time, it will be trying. It's such an encouragement to know that we're not left alone in Babylon. Dr. John B.

Reilly Amen. Amen. And you know, I want to today just sort of make some parallels and talk about our own culture and what people are having to face in modern day Babylon. But in Babylon, in Abekanesh's Babylon, you know, there really were temples on every block and places to turn in. What are the temples in our Babylon that we're facing?

Because every Wiccan perverse generation has to face temples. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think in America especially, we're around the world, it's not inherently wrong to have sports. Sports is not inherently sinful.

But the idolatry of sports, again, it's the, I think the religion of America is professional sports or sporting in some sense. It takes so much of our time, so much of our affection, so much of the world is given to entertainment. It seems like that is a tricky thing to navigate because it's not inherently sinful to be entertained. Just inherently, like entertainment, it's not inherently sinful, but boy, it sure as it can be and often is a snare to even our own church members. And I don't know if that was one of the temples you were thinking about, Scott, but that's what came immediately to my mind.

Well, you find those kinds of temples throughout history. Think about Rome. You know, the Roman emperors, you know, created the Coliseums to keep people entertained and also to give them food. That's what they did. And they really did.

They did it intentionally to inebriate the people. Yeah. It seems that way. It seems that way that people are so distracted by entertainment and sports. And now there's the religious temples that we have around us that's everywhere.

We can talk about that too, but it's numbing down our greater objective of living for God and living for something more important than just temporal pleasures. And I think sports is, and I like, I'm the one that grew up playing basketball. I love basketball. I love, I even like watching football. So I'm not anti-sports, but I see the idolatry that's so easily wrapped up in it so quickly.

So I think we need to be aware of that as we live in it. Not necessarily say, hey, sports is evil, but the idolatry of anything, anything become an idol. And I think vanity fair, Babylon is somewhat like vanity fair. I think of vanity fair, I think of going to the state fair and there's people yelling at you in all angles, come play this game, buy this, do this. None of it in of itself necessarily is inherently sinful, but the distraction of the whole collection of pulls and drawing.

It's the pride of life, the love of this world. I mean, this is Babylon, this is Vanity Fair, this is the world we live in. And it's so hard to navigate because the temptations are so subtle, and it's easy to justify a little bit here, a little bit there until Sunday services, Sunday is minimized, worship of the Lord is minimized, family worship is minimized, and the things of this world overtake us. And so we're sent into Babylon, we're sent into vanity fair, but we've got to be aware of vanity fair is a dangerous place to live. Yeah.

When we talk about our pagan temples, you're really just answering the questions of people aren't chasing after God, what are they chasing after? We're all going to chase after something. So definitely material affluence. If people aren't chasing after God, one of the things they might be chasing after very well is material influence. If you look at social media influencers, you're looking at people who are living the high life.

It's about where you're vacationing, what your home's like, what kind of car you're driving, things like that. So certainly that's one of our pagan temples. And it's like, it's like you're driving down the streets of Babylon, just like ancient Babylon And there you are, you know, you're going by, well, there's this distraction, you know, there's this other diversion over here. And, you know, they have relative qualities of evil. Some of them are just slapped down evil.

And some of them are just distractions from what's good. And everybody's driving down the road and there's a lot of places you can turn in, you know, in Babylon. Lawful until it becomes an idol, right? Right. Or let's just say a thief, a thief of something better.

Yeah. Right, right, yeah. Yeah, that's why this conference will be good, because it's just we need constant refocusing, reminding of what God has us here for. And I was thinking through this, you know, it's not that God has called us to hate eating food and enjoying sunsets and joining our families. And again, part of this is how we can live, plant, build, and not just think I can't do anything until I get to heaven and I'm just gonna try to fast forward this life and get past this life and this life altogether is evil and let's just get to heaven as fast as we can.

No, no, we can enjoy life. We can enjoy the things that God has given us to richly enjoy. And I love, I mean, I love good food. I just got back from Peru and I was like, man, this is awesome. This food is good, delicious.

Why did God give us taste buds? They're like, yeah, we can enjoy common day life for the glory of God without that becoming a doledger to us, without falling into the rut of loving vanity fair. So there's this fine line that God has called us to walk in this world and live in this world for his glory while navigating all the pagan temples that are on every corner. We're fresh off election season. Contending for political influence has to be one of those things.

I want one of my dearest friends, Bamone's Christless conservatism, So we can say, oh, the people on the other side of the aisle, they're all they're about is political influence. Well, we have plenty of that on our side of the aisle and very little of it has to do with Jesus Christ and his kingdom. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, at this conference, we really want to be an encouragement to families, hey, there's a way forward, you know, in the midst of Babylon.

It's going to be a super street level practical conference. All the speakers have really helpful kind of things you can put into practice day to day. And so I'm really, really, really excited about it. Yeah, and it's gonna be good to give hope because especially before the election and even now, it's like, yeah, I hear so many people say, it's like almost a depressing mindset. Like this world is falling apart.

It's only gonna get more and more evil. And it's kind of like almost a defeatist perspective of wanting to crawl in a hole, get off the grid and isolate and just basically live in despair. And so I think giving us hope of that we can live in this world and be protected by God's grace and we can raise a family for the glory of God and we can have hope in the midst of the world seemingly falling apart. I say seemingly, the world is falling apart. But yet the church, the Christian home, the Christian can thrive and be full of joy.

There's still joy to be had in this world, not from this world, but in this world. We drive our joy from out of this world, but it remains with us in this world. Christ said it this way, it's good for me to leave so I can, and when I leave, I'm not leaving you entirely, I'm sending my peace, I'm sending my spirit, I'm sending my joy with you so that your joy might be full. And so we can live a victorious life full of joy and happiness in a world that's falling apart because we have a purpose and our purpose will be successful. We have a reason to remain here and we should seek to do all that we can to make a difference.

It's a real difference. We're not left here to build for something that's going to just completely fall apart in the end, so why waste our time? Why invest in doing what we can if it's just all going to crumble. No, we're making an eternal investment in this temporal life that we're called to live today. And so there's a lot of confidence and joy that we can have and we need to have and not just live in despair.

Yeah, and you know, hey, look, listen to some of the messages that are going to preach. They're exactly along the line that you're talking about. Sam Waldron, Christ's promises to parents raising children in Babylon. Alexander Strouk, maintaining marital foundations in Babylon. Brian Borgman, worshipping when it's dark.

Scott Aniel, faithful worship in a pagan land. Rest, work, and discipleship in Babylon. That's Kevin Swanson. So the topics are going to be very helpful and super practical. So I was thinking about this whole thing about our Babylon and their Babylon.

Our Babylon is not exactly like their Babylon. They had different things going on that we don't have. We have things going on here that they don't. And, you know, in Babylon, in ancient Babylon, they were forced to bow down to certain idols, like publicly and in the street. And you know, I just wonder in our Babylon, what are the idols that we're compelled to bow down to?

Hey, we're definitely coming out of a time and I think it would be naive to think it's over where certain viewpoints were labeled as disinformation and are sort of, you're hey, you're not even allowed to say these things. So 10 or 15 minutes ago, early in the podcast, somebody said, yeah, hey, now you can say that there are only two genders again. It wasn't very long ago where there was, you know, a significant price to pay to say something different than that, right? Oh yeah, where they were. It's almost like there was a real conspiracy among the banks to cut off Christian businesses or any businesses that would not fall in line with the Wolk ideology or with the homosexual ideology.

And so there was a real price to be paid. And I think there still is a price to be paid to stand strong for what the Bible says. And it's like you have to bow down to this in order to buy, sell, and trade in Babylon. If you're going to live in Babylon, you're going to have to serve the idols of Babylon. And that's always been Satan's tactic.

And we see it even in our own day. You know, Jeff, you preached this, you preached a message at G3 at the social justice conference, I think it was, and you gave kind of a history of persecution, but it was really a history of various kinds of governments that are in control and what happens. And the bottom line, if I remember correctly, at least what I extracted from it. It was, you know, it doesn't really matter what kind of government is in control. They're going to go after Christians, okay?

Yeah, I looked through how, that's like when I went through all the scenarios when the church was being persecuted by the state, when the church was protected by the state, when the state was ruled by the church. All these scenarios, true Christians were always the ones that were victims of the scenario. And I think that's the way Jesus said, I'm going to send you out before wolves and you're going to be persecuted. And I love how what Jesus says is said, but you're going to be victorious, not through avoiding persecution, but you'll be victorious even unto death. Like in the persecution, in the suppression of our religious beliefs, and that's how we're victorious because we mirror the victory of Jesus.

And he was victorious when everybody thought he was being conquered. He wasn't victorious because he stormed Rome, the capital of the Roman Empire, not because he raised an army and he evaded persecution and death. No, he was victorious because he was persecuted and he did die, but in his death and persecution he rose. He came through it victoriously. And I think our victory will be in standing strong under high pressure and in persecution and that crisis, I'll never leave you, I won't forsake you.

And in such difficult environments, we don't compromise, we don't succumb, We stand strong. And I think that brings greater glory to the Lord than if we're in a position where we're ruling over the heathen, and the heathen are basically being forced against their will to Christian rules that they don't like. No, I think there's more glory in the Christians staying faithful to their conscience in the Babylon. And I think that's the world we're in. That's the world we'll be in.

But it's not a depressing outlook if we see that Christ has overcome the world to be of good cheer. It is our Father's good pleasure to give us the kingdom. And we will be victorious, and we are victorious. And it's hopeful. Yeah, and God hasn't chosen in history, and anytime in history, where the church is gonna rule over the government.

But he has chosen that Christians glorify God under whatever government they live in. You know, when I was publishing Pierre Verre on civil disobedience, when to disobey the whole doctrine of the civil magistrate and when Christians should defy the civil magistrate. He makes really interesting comments about government. He says, well, there are basically three kinds of government, and it really just matters kind of who's in charge and the character of those people. But the truth is God is always so far in history.

He's chosen to glorify himself through people who live under governments for the glory of God. Yeah, that's a great book. That little book about Peter Vare is a wonderful little book. And so I'm glad you published that and it's so relevant. In fact, it's relevant, we're talking about in every age and every place of the world, but especially in the age that we're living in.

Yeah. Okay. Well, hey, I can't wait to see you at the conference. It'll be a great time and good to see your family again and everybody else. Yeah, I'm excited.

I'm excited to see you guys in person and be with the Saints. My family's excited. They're dragging me there. I mean, I'm willingly coming, but I think... Jeff, are you also coming to the pre-conference for Singles, Holiness, and the Lord?

He's gonna preach there, yeah. Okay, all right. Yes, I mean, yeah. Yeah, we gotta get these single people married. Absolutely.

Hey, every year I have a few couples come up and they hold up this ring and they say, we met here. Yeah, that's wonderful. I like it. So we also have a preaching conference beforehand with Joe Beeke and Brian Borgman on experiential preaching. Hey, hope you can bring some of your guys to that too.

That'll be really helpful. Those are good men to talk about that topic. And they live it. I mean, they do it every time they stand up to preach, experiential preaching. Okay, Jeff, thank you, man.

We'll see you soon. Thank you, guys. God bless. And thank you for joining us on the Church and Family Life podcast, and I hope you can join us next time. Church and Family Life is proclaiming the sufficiency of Scripture by helping build strong families and strong churches.

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