What are you doing to evangelize the lost? The truth is, the crushing need of all of humanity is for a Savior. Whether you’re “nice” and well-to-do or living in the slums, your only hope from the just wrath of God is through the Gospel, which “is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes” (Rom. 1:16). In this podcast, hosts Scott Brown and Jason Dohm discuss the need, scope, and motives for evangelism with pastor Rob Ventura—and how Christians can prepare themselves to share the Gospel, the focus of Ventura’s new book, Equipped to Evangelize.

Welcome to the Church and Family Life podcast. We're going to talk about a really good book that Rob Ventura has just written, Equipped to Evangelize. We Need It. Hope you enjoy the discussion. Music Okay, so Jason, here's what we know.

Almost nobody evangelizes who calls themselves Christians. I've seen statistics out of the SBC, and very, very few people ever share their faith. And so our buddy, Rob Ventura, just wrote a book called Equip to evangelize. You know, I've been a Christian for 40 years. I've been a pastor for, a full-time pastor for almost 15 years, and I could still use some help.

So, Rob, I'm looking forward to reading the book cover to cover, but hearing about it now. Yeah, so you're the pastor of Grace Community Church in Rhode Island. There you go. We've interviewed you. What a wonderful place to pastor.

Yeah, I'll bet. Yeah. Hard ground is good ground, right? I guess. Jesus was called the root out of dry ground, so we want to be the same.

Price like this. That's great. Okay, so you end this book by saying, if you are a Christian, you are an evangelist. Okay? I thought that was a great way to end the book.

So, you talk about the need for evangelism. Why is there a need for evangelism? Every Christian should know this. Yeah, the need for evangelism is the great commission that Christ has given to his church. That's the need for us to fulfill it, to obey our Lord, both as people in the pew and also as pastors, because Paul says to pastors that they are to do the work of an evangelist.

And then from the human level, the need is to reach people with the gospel because we know that without the gospel, people are going to hell. So there's a great urgency. We've got the cure, which is the gospel, and people who have not been saved are headed to hell. So we should always have this great burden upon us. The need for us to do it is to obey our Lord Jesus Christ in the various ways that we could evangelize, whether it be street preaching, knocking on doors, one-on-one interactions, of course, parents at home, discipling their children.

So, we need to do it because we're called to do it. And of course, the need for the unsaved is that they would hear the gospel and be saved and be delivered from the wrath to come. You know, I was, this morning I woke up just in my normal devotions, I was in Psalm 36, one through four. And it's remarkable about the truth of the unbeliever. He says, there is no fear of God before his eyes, for he flatters himself in his own eyes.

When he finds out his iniquity and when he hates, the words of his mouth are wickedness and deceit. He has ceased to be wise and do good. He devises wickedness on his bed. He sets himself in a way that is not good, he does not abhor evil. That's quite a list of problems with the unconverted man.

Yeah, and the gospel is the cure for that man. That's why Paul says, therefore, knowing the terror of the Lord, what do we do? We persuade men. We don't sit back and just keep in our comfortable little quarters as Christians. No, knowing the terror of the Lord, what do we do?

We persuade men. We don't sit back and just keep in our comfortable little quarters as Christians. No, knowing the terror of the Lord, Paul says, we persuade men. So unbelievers right now are not only gonna experience the judgment of God in the final day, they're already under the judgment of God. And again, we've got this great cure, which Paul calls in Romans one and verse 16, the power of God unto salvation or deliverance.

Deliverance from what? Deliverance from the wrath of God, Romans 1, 18. And so we go to the loss with the good news of the doing, dying, and rising of Jesus Christ our Lord, and we pray that the Holy Spirit would bless the preaching of the gospel to the conversion of many, just like when we were saved. Someone came to us. We needed the Savior, and thank God someone came and told us about Him.

Rob, we're working through the basic structure of the book we just talked about, kind of the first main heading, the need. The next is the scope. Talk to us about the scope. Yeah, so who is to be our evangelistic target? Who are we to go after?

And the Bible's plain. We are to go after all people with the gospel. We have to share the gospel with all people, far and wide. Jesus said, make disciples of all nations. And so no one is to be excluded from the gospel.

So those people that we might think, oh, they don't deserve the gospel, whether they may be just radical, whatever, in our day embracing whatever pagan ideology, etc. Christ came into the world to save sinners. He came to seek and to save that which is lost. And so all people, wherever they are, wherever we meet them, they are candidates for the mercy of Christ. You know, there's a temptation to think on one side of people as above the gospel, sophisticated, already nice, already moral, or people being below the gospel, too far gone, too given over to sin, and the truth of scripture is that nobody's above the gospel, nobody's below the gospel, that the crushing need of all of humanity is for a Savior, because we're, no matter how sophisticated and nice we are we're actually bent with God in our in our inner man Bent against God in our inner man.

It's well said brother. That's exactly right all people everywhere without discrimination Yeah, You make a big point of that, particularly going back to the Jewish-Gentile conflict in the early church, you know, as there was preferential treatment, you know, to the Jews. And of course, the apostle Paul, you know, the apostle to the Gentiles broke that up. Well, that's right. Yeah, basically the mindset of the Jews was, we don't do Gentiles, but God was like, I do.

And so, you know, he had to send out, of course, Peter with Cornelius and all the rest, and Paul preaching the gospel to the Gentiles, had to go report back to the church and tell the wonderful things that God did among the Gentiles. And then they all cried out saying, then God has granted the Gentiles everlasting life. And so it's a beautiful thing, but even in the first century, there were, you know, cultural lines and boundaries that people didn't want to cross, and there was racism even in the early church, and God just had to keep teaching the church that there's neither Jew nor Gentile, for we're all one in Christ Jesus. You know, I was just reading about Jonah the other day and Jonah did not want to go to the Ninevites and frankly, why? Hey, these were really brutal people.

These were bad people. You know, think about going into downtown Dearborn, Michigan right now, full of Muslims. Are you going to go there? You know, God actually calls us to go to dangerous places. And Jonah ends up saying, Oh God, I knew you would have mercy.

That's why I didn't want to go. I knew you would have mercy on these people. Yeah. And that's the thing. I think when we think about the scope, we've got to remember that, you know, God has a heart for all kinds of people And we've got to pray, oh Lord, give me this heart.

And whereas in the Old Testament, you had the Israelites going into the land of Canaan to subdue it as it were, the New Testament church is called to go to all the world and subdue the world. We don't do it with swords, but we do it with the gospel. And so we've got that great commission to all the nations I mean, could you imagine what that would have sounded like to a Jewish ear to hear Jesus words go and make disciples of all The nations wait a minute Jesus. I thought you just meant Jerusalem No Jesus says actually a start in Jerusalem and then you go out from there out from there because God has a heart for all kind of People Jew or otherwise and thank God for that because if not, we wouldn't be talking today as say believers You know, I I find myself, you know put off often by appearances Mmm, And like if we saw the Rob Ventura 40 years ago, he's dragging around New York City with his boombox playing rap music, right? You would not want to come near him.

I know. I know. But thank God someone stuck their neck out and said, you know what, this man needs Christ and boy did I ever. So, Rob, the next heading is motives go. Yeah, just regarding motives, I mean, a two-fold motive always, and we should keep this before us, the glory of God and the good of man, right?

All that we do, we seek to do for the glory of God, right? What is man's chief end? It's to glorify God. And we glorify God in A, obeying him to preach the gospel to all creatures. And then also when people get saved, what do they do?

Ephesians chapter one, they glory in God, right? They give glory to God, to the praise of the glory of his what? Of his grace. And so God is glorified when people are saved and they give him glory in turn. And then the good of man, again, the second prong.

We know that people are lost again, whether they're educated or not, whatever their backgrounds are, whether they're drag queens, whether they're the president, whoever they are, rich, poor, not, whatever the case is, everyone needs Jesus. And we need to keep that in mind, that these people are on the broad road that leads to destruction and that, as we'll talk about in a moment, we are the agents that God has committed this gospel to. He has entrusted the gospel into our hands, not into the hands of angels, but into our hands. God doesn't ride across the skies. I tell people, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you'll be saved.

No, he has called his church to go with that glorious message and to share it with others for the glory of God and for the good of our fellow men. You're trying to democratize the preaching of the gospel. You're trying to make it. You even quoted Acts 8 for those who are scattered when it about preaching the word, just these regular old guys that were scattered. Well, that's right.

This takes all types of shapes and forms. I preached open air in New York City for just about a decade then I went to New Jersey preached open air I'll be preaching open air this Saturday Just got an invite to preach open air this Saturday down in Providence and that that's not for everybody We have a deacon in our church a beloved man of God. He likes knocking on doors with others. I personally I went with him once that is not my particular Field that I like to be in knocking on doors I always feel that someone's gonna say we don't want any Jehovah witnesses here and I'm like I'm not a Jehovah witness in the technical sense I am a witness for Jehovah but not in the sense not in the sense they're thinking about. But again, one on one, I've really been pressing myself saying, God ordained if you'd be sitting next to this person on this airplane, are you going to keep your mouth shut?

Or again, you're at this place, at a restaurant. My wife and I are always giving gospel tracks To people we have you know, once we use either from Chapel Library I think Ray Comfort has a very good one What is it million dollar trillion dollar track? Whatever it is And we just leave it to be a witness. And I tell you, we've gone back to those same restaurants and people have told us that trillion dollar tract is sitting in the back where all of the people work and people get to read it all day long. And so just seeking to be a witness.

You know, Paul said, I wanna have my hands clear of the blood of all men on the day of judgment. And I think with all the things that we seek to do as Christians, that this is an important aspect of our lives. It's not the only thing, but it's an important thing. So, Rob, back to motives for a minute. I'm so thankful that you really set this in order.

Love for people is definitely a motive for evangelism, we say amen to that. But it's very easy to have a man-centered gospel and a man-centered view of evangelism where human need becomes sort of the sum total of all that this is about. But the glory of God, actually putting that first and acknowledging that God ought to be loved, God ought to be served, God ought to be honored in the world is really where we start, and then the love from man really is a good second to that. Yeah, amen. And I say in the book, and even if no one is saved, God is still glorious.

It doesn't take away from his glory at all. He is glorified when people are saved, but whether they're saved or not, he is still glorious and Praise God for that. Yeah. One of the difficulties that we have with motives is that having a wrong motive can just lead us into just arguing. Argue, argue, argue, and you don't love that person.

You don't see them really through the eyes of the Lord Jesus. You're trying to win an argument now, and it's like tit for tat. And I'm not saying that it's necessarily wrong to argue. You've got to argue for the supremacy of Christ and the sinfulness of man, and that does get you in arguments, but it's so easy in the midst of the argument to actually lose your love for that person. Well, that's great.

I found that myself. Yeah. I was going to say, brother, just like me, I've walked away sometimes thinking, why did you spend so much time arguing? This is not about being right or wrong. This is about this person who has a never dying soul before you.

It's like, you almost want to just throw away the whole argument and just weep for the person, right? Whitefield, the great evangelist, you know, when he's preaching open air, he would weep so much and people would say to him, why do you weep so much when you preach? And he says, because you won't weep for yourselves. And so, I just want to be weeping for people and opening my mouth as I can to share the gospel of Christ with them. So yeah, so there is a place, and Scott, you were going there, I think, in your thoughts for apologetics, right?

There's a place for polemics. All that stuff is good and right. But when we're, and that'll come up in evangelism, and we'll use all those things as well. But again, we're not trying to win an argument, we're trying to win people. Paul says that I may by all means win some.

You know, so you talk about that we are both an aroma to those who are being saved, and that we're an aroma of death, a fragrance of death to those who are perishing. Could you talk to us about that? Yeah, that's Paul's language. And I open up that text in a chapter. It's very sobering.

Wherever we go, you know, we are senting people and the gospel goes out and it scents everyone. The gospel is good, it always has a good scent, but it's those people, whether they're believing or rejecting the gospel, that makes it either a scent of life unto life, or really a stench of death unto death if they reject it, but it's those people. The accountability is upon the individual. If they say I want nothing to do with Christ and all that, well that message then becomes unto them death unto death. But for those who, by the grace of God, the electing work of the Father in their lives, drawing them to Christ, they turn from their sins, they trust in Christ alone for life and salvation.

Those people, it becomes an aroma of life unto life. It's what we've experienced as believers, and again, all because of the kind mercies of God. Robert R. Reilly Rob, talk to us like you're talking to your local church, your dear church. You know these people.

You have an idea of which ones are evangelizing and not. We often don't really know, but. So turn it on for your church and Jason's church, because we need to hear this as well. Yeah, well I'm gonna begin by recommending to them an excellent new book entitled, Equipped to Evangelize by Rob Ventura. That's, I'm going to turn it on, but no, absolutely fair.

Buy 10 copies and give them to your friends. Exactly. Well, you know, one thing I think that this whole issue with evangelism we we model it right and so You know you guys have heard me preach and every time I preach I generally have a basic structure to every my every one Of my sermons. It's a classic al-martin structure, and I think it really comes from the Puritans, it's proclamation, explanation, and application, proclaim, explain, and apply. And so, every sermon, I will, of course, give applications at the end to the believer, but then also, I will just have just a few minutes for the non-Christian.

And so, they hear that every week, Pastor V, he's leaning over the pulpit and his tie is flying back, and he's calling the unbeliever to turn from their sins and to trust in Christ alone for life and salvation. So, they hear this. It's kind of like what they say regarding preaching. It's more Caught than taught right so people are seeing right they're hearing Scott. They're hearing Jason They're seeing expository preaching and they're catching it.

Well all of that's great I just had in this piece about evangelism When they see us really just stopping for a moment speaking to the people there. You're here this day. You're not a Christian What does this mean for you going after the children? Of course when I say going after I mean addressing them and love We speak to them and then the parents start doing the same, and everyone in the church starts having this culture, if you will, of evangelism. Again, this is not all that our church is about, but it's part of the ministry.

And as we're doing that, I start seeing people catching this type of disposition so that when we have our prayer meetings, it's regularly every week Almost every week where people saying I spoke to this one. Let's pray for this one. Let's pray for this one So again more caught than taught and then additionally additionally, Just some of the the real great books on Evangelism that I try to push among the people books. No doubt. I'm sure much better than than mine, but they're old So I did mine to have something fresh but you know today's evangelism By Ernie Reisinger.

That's just a great book Evangelism and a sovereignty of God by Packer just a great great book today's evangelism Walt Chantry Authentic or synthetic those are just three classic books in this regard Again, as I mentioned a moment ago, they've been out about 30 years and there was nothing new from a Reformed guy, so I thought it was time to write something on it that was current. And Scott, You mentioned in the beginning that you know, you know very few Christians who evangelize well, you know the the the Comment that's made against us as Calvinist is well Calvinists don't evangelize. Well, you know check the record We actually do right? I mean you've heard of Whitfield you've heard of Edwards You've heard of Spurgeon you've heard of Luther Calvin and all the rest Not only were these guys evangelizing regularly along with the Puritans, they were also sending out missionaries and doing all the rest. But this is a reformed perspective on evangelism, which we simply just call a biblical perspective.

Amen. Rob, thank you so much for the conversation. I hope everybody goes out and gets that book equipped for evangelism. And I hope you can join us at the Church and Family Life podcast next time. Church and Family Life is proclaiming the sufficiency of Scripture by helping build strong families and strong churches.

If you found this resource helpful, we encourage you to check out ChurchandFamilyLife.com. Ask next time.